“We have our game now, and we get to show that to people.”
That was the message that Football NSW referee Chloe Gray wanted to impart to CommBank Junior Matilda Talia Younis to describe what Playing Unstoppable meant to her.
Gray was in conversation with Younis as part of the OUR GAME x LEGO Mentorship Series, where Younis spoke to five women in different roles within the football industry.
The 25-year-old was a rising star of refereeing when she took charge of the NPLW NSW Grand Final in 2022 between Northern Tigers and Macarthur Rams, and had been a part of the first all-female referee crew for a Macarthur Football Association Men’s Match.
However, adversity towards the end of that year drove her to her new purpose: to lead and inspire the next generation of referees to achieve their goals.
Read on to discover the full conversation when player meets referee!
Talia: What’s your role and what do you do?
Chloe: I am a referee. I love refereeing, it’s fun! When I’m in the middle, I get to run around everywhere, and try and help the game as much as I can. And then when I’m on the sideline holding the flag, I get to help my central referee do everything they need to do to make sure the game goes well.
T: How did you get into the football industry?
C: Not going to lie, I did get into reffing because I was already playing and my parents were like, let’s earn a bit of money! Like any good referee doing it for the money, I then worked out it’s actually really, really cool and really, really fun. So, I went from a player to a referee.
T: What do you love about what you do, and why do you do it?
C: I just love the camaraderie. I’ve gone to so many games and so many tournaments, and met so many cool people. Players, coaches, and admin people, as well as all the referees. Getting those lifelong friendships is so cool.
T: What is one of the main challenges that you face?
C: For me personally, probably injury. That hurts a lot, both physically and mentally. That’s probably one of the biggest ones you have to face as a referee, as well as the stuff you have to do on the field.
T: How did you get to where you are today?
C: I’d like to say through a lot of hard work. I’ve had really cool people helping me out the entire time. I started doing local footy at the park, like under 12s matches. Slowly and surely I got to follow the pathway, similar to what you do as a player – you start local, you go to NPL. We did the same thing refereeing. The support that you get along the way is how I got there, as well as a little bit of hard work on the side.
T: What was the lowest point in your career, and how did you overcome it?
C: The lowest point of my career would have been two years ago. I just moved into my new house, and I got a phone call telling me that I didn’t get chosen to be an A-League referee. That stung a lot. Getting that phone call around finals time of someone saying ‘we don’t think you’re good enough’ - it really, really hurts.
I had to take some time off from the game, but I then worked out that I’m still a good referee, even if I’m not going to be A-League material. Being able to come back to the game and be supported by all of the friends and family, and then being able to support others to get onto the A-League pathway and to just be a good referee, has made it worth it.
T: Who was your mentor, or who inspired you to be a referee?
C: I’ve had a few mentors throughout the years. I’ve closely worked with Brad Wright, who is now a FIFA assistant referee. We grew up in the same area, we went through the same pathway. He comes down and mentors me and has been able to help me throughout things. I had the pleasure of meeting Kate Jacewicz, the FIFA referee. I wouldn’t necessarily say that she was a mentor but she was a huge inspiration to what I wanted to achieve as a referee and what I want to give back to the game.
T: What is your goal?
C: My old goal used to be to make it as far as I can. My new goal now is to get as many referees as far as they can. Be it refereeing NPL, just getting into the game, or making it all the way to FIFA and going to the Olympics and the World Cup. I want to help everyone out.
T: What are some words of advice?
C: It doesn’t matter what you do, be it reffing, be it playing, being at school – just try. If it’s what you can do on the day, it’s 100% of what you can do. You try and that’s the main thing.
T: What traits does a referee need to have?
C: The referee needs to be someone that is willing to be the person that the game needs it to be. Someone who is strong, someone that’s empathetic. Being fit is always really helpful, especially when we’re going to try and keep up with players like you and your speed. Anything that helps improve the game is what a referee needs to have. You get to learn that every single time you go out onto the field.
T: What was refereeing your first game like?
C: Scary. Scary, but fun. I remember going out and being that little bit nervous, because obviously everyone always feels so much bigger than you. But coming off the match, it was just so much happiness.
T: What was it like blowing the whistle for the first time?
C: Oh my God, I was horrible! I sounded like a dying cat! Blowing a whistle is so hard, I don’t think people understand that, but I sounded, really, really bad.
T: How did you overcome that?
C: I pretty much just kept blowing it until it was better. It eventually turned out to be better, which is nice – it’s just practice. The same way you’ve got to work on your first touch as a player, you’ve got to work on blowing a whistle as a referee. Sometimes I spent a lot of time annoying my parents in the house.
T: What was it like giving out your first red card?
C: It wasn’t as bad as I thought it was going to be! It was such an easy red card to give, it was DOGSO (denial of an obvious goalscoring opportunity), what players sometimes call ‘last man’. It was nice and easy, which was a good one to have, because there were no questions, no complaints.
T: What does Play Unstoppable mean to you?
C: Play Unstoppable is doing whatever you can to make yourself enjoy the game, and to get involved and to stay involved. Do whatever you need – whether you want to play, or to do, or to coach, or to manage, or to ref, it’s just doing it. You’re finding a move to overcome whatever it is, whenever that happens. Football was something that was put to the side for all of us. Playing unstoppable is having that opportunity now, knowing that we have a spot, that we can come and play, we can do whatever we want. We have our game now and we get to show that to people.
This was the fourth episode of a five-part series where Talia Younis meets women from across the football industry. Make sure you catch up on all of the episodes on ourgameaus.com.au!
ENHANCE YOUR REFEREEING SKILLS
Whether you're just starting your refereeing journey or aiming to advance your expertise, Football Australia has everything you need! Discover the pathway and a variety of training courses designed to help you excel on the field.
Take the next step today and discover more HERE.